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Author Topic: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues  (Read 764 times)

Bluestar

  • Join date: Jun 2022
  • Posts: 75
PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« on: Wed, 22 Jun 2022 16:11 »
As I try to get PSX setup for my system (day 3) I have the following issues.  Before I start all my PFC Throttle Quadrant Console with the Two Engine Jet Enhanced Throttle Quadrant (PFC) work without any issues using P3d and the PMDG B744. 

1.  I was able to assign and calibrate FLAPS without any issues.  When I went to assign the throttles I discovered the right throttle lever also moves the FLAPS assigned earlier (they are positions 5 & 6).  Basically positions five and six on the PFC are assigned the same USB location.  A link to my setup (https://flypfc.com/shop/throttle-quadrants/jet-throttle-quadrants/two-engine-jet-enhanced-spoiler-throttle-reverser-flap-ga-button/)

2.  I way unable to find Reverser 1 & 2 and Reverser 3 & 4 in the USB drop down menu similar to those for the Throttles.

3.  I was unable to locate an assignment for the Parking Brake in the USB drop down menu.

4.  I was unable to get the Gear Cycle to work correctly with the Gear Lever on the PFC.  Moving the PFC Gear Switch to the up position brings the Gear Handle from Down to OFF.  I'm not sure that will raise the gear?  I read earlier where one user had created a "work around" but never was able to figure out what that was.

I'm still struggling with the screens, but will start another thread if I am unable to get it resolved. 

Bode

Hardy Heinlin

  • Moderator
  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 13155
    • Aerowinx
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 22 Jun 2022 17:17 »
... the right throttle lever also moves the FLAPS assigned earlier ...

Are you sure you haven't assigned your right throttle to both the right thottle AND the flaps? Theoretically, you can assign one hardware part to multiple software functions; so when you assign something different, it won't automatically remove the previous assignment. Can you check each item on the USB list that the right throttle is really only assigned to the right lever?


Quote
... unable to find Reverser 1 & 2 and Reverser 3 & 4 ...

I'm sorry. Such an asymmetric pair-wise reverse function for USB is not implemented in PSX. Until now there have been no such inquiries from PSX users. The pair functions are only implemented for the forward thrust.

You could assign just your left or just your right reverser to the all-4-engines-reverse function. On the 747 you would pull all four levers anyway, or pull a symmetric pair with 1+4 or 2+3 in certain cases -- which isn't possible with your two-engine model either anyway.


Quote
I was unable to locate an assignment for the Parking Brake in the USB drop down menu.

Again something that isn't implemented in the USB section. I'm sorry! PSX is specialized for TCP/IP networking which provides almost all PSX variables. USB is just a side product for essential flight controls.

To set the parking brake, you need to depress both pedals (USB or keyboard spacebar) while holding the B key (or while holding a networked park brake lever). Then release the pedals, then release the B key.


Quote
I was unable to get the Gear Cycle to work correctly with the Gear Lever on the PFC.

Sorry #3. There's no gear up-off-down function for the USB section. It's only available via network. The gear cycle function is just what is says: Each button push cycles the lever through its 3 positions. This only works with a momentary pushbutton, not with a 3-way switch.


Best wishes,

|-|ardy

Bluestar

  • Join date: Jun 2022
  • Posts: 75
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 22 Jun 2022 22:39 »
I went back into USB and made sure that position 5 and position 6 were not assigned any where else.  In the USB page under line 140. PFC Throttle Quadrant Control - Slider there is a USB value shown. I can move position 5 and the value will change between 970 and -890.  I can then move position 6 and the value will be between 960 and a -960.  Again both USB values only show/move on Line 140.  I need position 5 to be Throttle 3 &4 and position 6 to be Flaps.

Bode 

Hardy Heinlin

  • Moderator
  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 13155
    • Aerowinx
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #3 on: Wed, 22 Jun 2022 23:01 »
I'm not sure what you mean by the word "position" ("position 5 and position 6") in the context of the word "line" (line 140). In your comment, do they have the same meaning -- "position" and "line"?

So do you have at least 140 USB items on the USB list?

Does it look like this?

...
Item #5 = Left throttle?
Item #6 = Right throttle?
...
etc.
...
Item #140 = Flap lever?
...


Or, by "position 5 and 6", do you mean flap lever positions? (Flaps 20 and 25?)

The flap calibration feature is only available for the slider which is assigned to "Flaps" on the axis pop-up menu.

The axis pop-up menu I mean is the one that provides these functions:

------------------
Off
Elevator
Aileron
etc.
etc.
Flaps
Throttles 1 & 2
Throttles 3 & 4
------------------


Are we on the same page?


An axis item is an item that provides a "Calibrate" button, followed by a USB signal indicator, followed by a pop-up menu. On this menu you may select "Flaps".

All other items are button items. Those have no "Calibrate" button.


|-|ardy


cavaricooper

  • Join date: Dec 2009
  • Location: KTPA
  • Posts: 1260
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 11:32 »
Bode-

I use the PFC Cirrus Console II (https://flypfc.com/shop/all/cirrus-ii-flight-console/) with the 737 TQ. I have mapped T1+T2 to the left throttle and T3+T4 to the right in PSX…. no issues with Spoiler or Flap. It is indeed important to calibrate each in PSX.

For the Gear and PB- it is indeed a problem… either use keystrokes or https://joytokey.net/en/.

HTH- C

Carl Avari-Cooper, KTPA

Bluestar

  • Join date: Jun 2022
  • Posts: 75
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 14:56 »
I'm not sure what you mean by the word "position" ("position 5 and position 6") in the context of the word "line" (line 140). In your comment, do they have the same meaning -- "position" and "line"?

So do you have at least 140 USB items on the USB list?

Does it look like this?

...
Item #5 = Left throttle?
Item #6 = Right throttle?
...
etc.
...
Item #140 = Flap lever?
...


Or, by "position 5 and 6", do you mean flap lever positions? (Flaps 20 and 25?)

The flap calibration feature is only available for the slider which is assigned to "Flaps" on the axis pop-up menu.

The axis pop-up menu I mean is the one that provides these functions:

------------------
Off
Elevator
Aileron
etc.
etc.
Flaps
Throttles 1 & 2
Throttles 3 & 4
------------------


Are we on the same page?


An axis item is an item that provides a "Calibrate" button, followed by a USB signal indicator, followed by a pop-up menu. On this menu you may select "Flaps".

All other items are button items. Those have no "Calibrate" button.


|-|ardy

I have the following throttle quadrant console - https://flypfc.com/shop/all/digital-throttle-quadrant-console/

I am using the following throttle quadrant - https://flypfc.com/shop/throttle-quadrants/jet-throttle-quadrants/two-engine-jet-enhanced-spoiler-throttle-reverser-flap-ga-button/

Under the USB tab in PSX  I have 174 position/lines.

When I talk about position 5 and 6 I'm referring to the Right Throttle (5) and FLAP (6).

On the PSX USB screen Position 140 is titled "PFC Throttle Quadrant Consol - slider". Position 141 has the same title as Position 140 Position 140 and 141 have a Calibrate button.

When I move the Right Throttle Lever the USB signal indicator moves from 900 to a -900 at Position 140. This is the only position where there the USB signal indicator moves.

When I move the FLAP Lever the USB signal indicator moves from 900 to -900 at Position 140.  This is the only position where the USB signal indicator moves. 

I can set the Axis Pop-Up Menu to Flaps using the Flap Lever and the Flaps will move.  The Flaps will move any time I move the Right Throttle Lever.  I set Line 140 to Throttle 3 & 4 using the Right Throttle Lever and throttles 3 & 4 move.  Throttles 3 & 4 move when I move the FLAP lever even though the FLAP lever was not assigned.

The basic problem is the RIght Throttle Lever and the FLAP Lever are both assigned the Line 140 "PFC Throttle Quadrant Consol - slider"  I'm not sure why the slider title since there is no slider on my throttle quadrant console.

Hopefully this clears up my earlier post.

Bode

Hardy Heinlin

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  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 13155
    • Aerowinx
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 16:24 »
Bizarre.

You are not running more than one PSX instance at a time, are you? I mean, you're not running two or more networked PSX instances on the computer where your USB stuff is plugged in?

Could you please post the text stored in the following files?

Aerowinx/Developers/USB-Detect.txt

Aerowinx/Logs/errors.txt


Thank you.

|-|ardy



(The term "slider" is used for all axes that have no centering function. E.g. aileron, rudder, elevator are axes. Throttles, speedbrake, flaps, toe brakes are sliders.)

Will

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Location: Chicago
  • Posts: 2419
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 16:29 »
Another way to approach this is to unassign all the USB axes in PSX, to get to a point where the controller isn't doing anything. Then start assigning axes one-by-one to the hardware.

If no USB axes are assigned in PSX, then moving the levers on the throttle hardware should do nothing.

Do you still see the problem if you assign only one hardware axis to something in PSX?

Will /Chicago /USA

Bluestar

  • Join date: Jun 2022
  • Posts: 75
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 17:39 »
Bizarre.

You are not running more than one PSX instance at a time, are you? I mean, you're not running two or more networked PSX instances on the computer where your USB stuff is plugged in?

Could you please post the text stored in the following files?

Aerowinx/Developers/USB-Detect.txt

Aerowinx/Logs/errors.txt


Thank you.

|-|ardy



(The term "slider" is used for all axes that have no centering function. E.g. aileron, rudder, elevator are axes. Throttles, speedbrake, flaps, toe brakes are sliders.)

USB detection test:

USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 0; Consumer Control; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 1; Numeric Key Pad; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 2; Button 2; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 3; Button 3; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 4; Button 4; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 5; Button 5; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 6; Button 6; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 7; Button 7; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 8; Button 8; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 9; Button 9; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 10; Button 10; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 11; Button 11; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 12; Button 12; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 13; Button 13; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 14; Button 14; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 15; Button 15; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 16; Button 16; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 17; Button 17; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 18; Button 18; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 19; Button 19; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 20; Button 20; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 21; Button 21; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 23; Button 22; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 24; Button 23; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 25; Button 24; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 26; Button 25; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 27; Button 26; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 28; Button 27; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 29; Button 28; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 30; Button 29; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 31; Button 30; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 0; System Sleep; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 1; System Power; 
USB Receiver | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 2; System Wake Up; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | slider; Throttle;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | y; Y Axis;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | x; X Axis;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 0; Button 0; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 1; Button 1; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 2; Button 2; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 3; Button 3; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 4; Button 4; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 5; Button 5; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 6; Button 6; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 7; Button 7; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 8; Button 8; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 9; Button 9; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 10; Button 10; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 11; Button 11; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 12; Button 12; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 13; Button 13; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 14; Button 14; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 15; Button 15; 
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; T;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; S;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; R;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; Q;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; P;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; O;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; N;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; M;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; L;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; K;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; J;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; I;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; H;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; G;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; F;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; E;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; D;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; C;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; B;  (analog)
PFC Cirrus Yoke | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; A;  (analog)
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 0; Volume Decrement; 
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 1; Volume Increment; 
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 2; Mute; 
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 3; Button 0; 
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 4; Button 1; 
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 5; Button 5; 
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; Axis 6;  (analog)
G432 Gaming Headset | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; Axis 7;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | y; Y Axis;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | x; X Axis;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | rz; Z Rotation;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | slider; Slider;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | ry; Y Rotation;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | rx; X Rotation;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | z; Z Axis;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 0; Button 0; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 1; Button 1; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 2; Button 2; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 3; Button 3; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 4; Button 4; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 5; Button 5; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 6; Button 6; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 7; Button 7; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 8; Button 8; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 9; Button 9; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 10; Button 10; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 11; Button 11; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 12; Button 12; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 13; Button 13; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 14; Button 14; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 15; Button 15; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 16; Button 16; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 17; Button 17; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 18; Button 18; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 19; Button 19; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 20; Button 20; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 21; Button 21; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 23; Button 22; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 24; Button 23; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 25; Button 24; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 26; Button 25; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 27; Button 26; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 28; Button 27; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 29; Button 28; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 30; Button 29; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | 31; Button 30; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | pov; Hat Switch; 
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; Move Up/Down;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | unknown; Move Right/Left;  (analog)
Gaming Keyboard G105 | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 0; Mute; 
Gaming Keyboard G105 | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 1; Volume Decrement; 
Gaming Keyboard G105 | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 2; Volume Increment; 
Gaming Keyboard G105 | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 3; Play/Pause; 
Gaming Keyboard G105 | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 4; Stop; 
Gaming Keyboard G105 | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 5; Scan Previous Track; 
Gaming Keyboard G105 | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 6; Scan Next Track; 
Saitek Pro Flight Combat Rudder Pedals | Stick | 0 | Unknown | y; Y Axis;  (analog)
Saitek Pro Flight Combat Rudder Pedals | Stick | 0 | Unknown | x; X Axis;  (analog)
Saitek Pro Flight Combat Rudder Pedals | Stick | 0 | Unknown | rz; Z Rotation;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | slider; Dial;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | slider; Slider;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | rz; Z Rotation;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | ry; Y Rotation;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | rx; X Rotation;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | z; Z Axis;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | x; X Axis;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 0; Button 0; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 1; Button 1; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 2; Button 2; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 3; Button 3; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 4; Button 4; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 5; Button 5; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 6; Button 6; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | 7; Button 7; 
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; T;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; S;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; R;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; Q;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; P;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; O;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; N;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; M;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; L;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; K;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; J;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; I;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; H;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; G;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; F;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; E;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; D;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; C;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; B;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | unknown; A;  (analog)

[Aerowinx Precision Simulator - Exceptions]

There were no errors shown.


Bode

Hardy Heinlin

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  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 13155
    • Aerowinx
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #9 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 18:50 »
If I got it right, this is the section with the items #140 through #146:

140 PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | slider; Dial;  (analog)
141 PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | slider; Slider;  (analog)
142 PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | rz; Z Rotation;  (analog)
143 PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | ry; Y Rotation;  (analog)
144 PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | rx; X Rotation;  (analog)
145 PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | z; Z Axis;  (analog)
146 PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | x; X Axis;  (analog)



So on your "Jet Enhanced" package you have 6 axes which are:
1. Speedbrake
2. Reverse L
3. Reverse R
4. Forward L
5. Forward R
6. Flaps

Correct?

Now, on that blue quote which starts at #140 we see 7 items, #140 being the first, #146 being the seventh.

Normally, you should see "Calibrate" buttons on all items from #140 thru #146.

You're seeing "Calibrate" just on #140 and #141? Not on #142 thru #146?

I'm wondering which of these items (140-146) refer to which hardware part (1-6). E.g. does the left reverser part refer to item #145?

Like Will suggested: What if you unplug all USB devices except for mouse, keyboard, and PFC quadrant? Just for a test. Will you then see more "Calibrate" buttons on the PFC items?

I see you have an "USB Receiver" and some other special USB gaming devices connected to the same computer. They might disturb the USB management on the sim side.


|-|ardy

Bluestar

  • Join date: Jun 2022
  • Posts: 75
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 21:27 »
I had tried Will's method before I started this post.  The only place where the Right Throttle Lever and the FLAP Lever show USB movement is Line 140. 

The six axes for the Jet Enhanced package are from left to right -

1.  Speed Brake
2.  Left Throttle
3.  Left Reverser
4.  Right Reverser
5.  Right Throttle
6.  Flaps

The PFC Throttle Quadrant in P3dv5.3 is showing the following:

Spoiler - Z Axes
Left Throttle - X Rotation
Left Reverser -  Y Rotation
Right Reverser - Z Rotation
Right Throttle -  Dial
Flaps - Slider

If you look at your blue chart Line 141 should be available to Slider (Flaps).  It is not.  The USB value for Line 140 is 0. 
If you look at your blue chart Line 140 should be available to Right Throttle which it is.
The problem is that Line 140 is also available to Flaps

From Line 140 to Line 146 there are USB values for each line except Line 141 which is 0.  From Line 140 to Line 146 there are Calibration boxes for each line.  For clarity Line 146 is the Rudder Trim rotary dial. 

It appears to me that there is a coding error concerning Line 140 and Line 141.  I do understand these type problems.  So the question is how can this coding error be resolved. 

I was going to send pictures of the USB page but I couldn't figure out how to post them.

Bode

Will

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Location: Chicago
  • Posts: 2419
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 22:04 »
Here is a way to post images to the forum:

https://aerowinx.com/board/index.php?topic=1744.0

Will /Chicago /USA

Hardy Heinlin

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  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 13155
    • Aerowinx
Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #12 on: Thu, 23 Jun 2022 22:33 »
The problem is that this erroneous flap lever signal is coming from a third-party Java interface which lies outside my coding scope. I might fix the problem if it were on the PSX assignment side of the system. But it's on the input signal side which I can't monitor nor analyse.

PSX obviously detects the "existence" of all hardware parts correctly; each part becomes an individual list item in the sim's detection text and on the sim's USB page. The only unusual effect being the flap lever's live signal coming in on an already occupied throttle channel.

Sherlock Holmes mode: I'm asking myself, what's so special in room #141 compared to the others? #141 is the only case where the function name and the part name are identical: They both read "slider". (Not, for example, "rz" and "Z Rotation", but "slider" and "Slider"; aside from the second name starting with a capital.)

If that could be a problem in the Java USB interface, let's see if there's a similar problem on your Saitek device. There you have another "slider" double name on the 4th Saitek part:

Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | y; Y Axis;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | x; X Axis;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | rz; Z Rotation;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | slider; Slider;  (analog)


Just for a test: Have you assigned anything there and does it work correctly?


|-|ardy

Bluestar

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Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 24 Jun 2022 02:06 »

Bluestar

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Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 24 Jun 2022 02:47 »
The problem is that this erroneous flap lever signal is coming from a third-party Java interface which lies outside my coding scope. I might fix the problem if it were on the PSX assignment side of the system. But it's on the input signal side which I can't monitor nor analyse.

PSX obviously detects the "existence" of all hardware parts correctly; each part becomes an individual list item in the sim's detection text and on the sim's USB page. The only unusual effect being the flap lever's live signal coming in on an already occupied throttle channel.

Sherlock Holmes mode: I'm asking myself, what's so special in room #141 compared to the others? #141 is the only case where the function name and the part name are identical: They both read "slider". (Not, for example, "rz" and "Z Rotation", but "slider" and "Slider"; aside from the second name starting with a capital.)

If that could be a problem in the Java USB interface, let's see if there's a similar problem on your Saitek device. There you have another "slider" double name on the 4th Saitek part:

Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | y; Y Axis;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | x; X Axis;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | rz; Z Rotation;  (analog)
Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | slider; Slider;  (analog)


Just for a test: Have you assigned anything there and does it work correctly?


|-|ardy

There is nothing assigned to the "Saitek X52 Flight Control System | Stick | 0 | Unknown | slider; Slider;  (analog)" and it does work correctly.

This is what the issue appears to be to me. If I am not understanding the problem correctly please let me know.
The problem appears to be a simple coding error.  It appears the coder added the USB value for Flaps and Right Throttle to Line 140.  The Right Throttle was coded correctly to Line 140. Flaps should have been coded to Line 141 but it wasn't, it was coded to Line 140 in error.

As things stand now I am no longer able to use levers 4, 5, 6 and the Gear Switch on my PFC Throttle Console.  Levers 5 and 6 because they are linked by the coding issue. I've also lost the use of lever 4 because the Reversers have not been split to 1/2 and 3/4 like the throttles.  I assigned All Reversers to Lever 3.  The Gear Switch is not usable as was discussed earlier.  The manual Flap Switch has now been assigned for the Flaps.

What has me baffled is all the Levers in my PFC Throttle Console work without any issues in P3dv5.3.

I'm about to start day 4 of this adventure and I still haven't flown PSX and it appears it will be awhile.  Head-Shaking-Mode.   


Will

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Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 24 Jun 2022 03:06 »
Here are two ideas.

If it turns out that there is an error late in the USD assignments, then you may want to make sure that your throttle hardware is recognized first. To do this, you could physically unplug all the USB devices from your computer. Then plug in only the throttle hardware. That way, it would occupy USB positions 1-35 instead of 120-145 (or whatever). This could help isolate the error. If it works this way, then you could plug your other USB devices in to the computer sequentially to preserve the throttle hardware's principal spot.

The other idea has to do with the gear switch. The problem (if I understand correctly) is that your hardware switch has only two positions (UP and DOWN) while the real Boeing gear handle has three positions (UP, DOWN, and OFF). One way to make this work with a two position switch is to assign the hardware gear switch to the gear toggle command, but also assign a joystick button to the same thing.

That way, to raise the gear, you would move the lever up, and tap the button. To move the gear to off, tap the button again. Then to lower the gear, move the lever down.

GEAR UP: Move the lever up, tap the button
GEAR OFF: Tap the button
GEAR DOWN: Move the lever down

It's not "realistic," but might be more natural than just using the lever alone (where it could get out of synch, e.g. down when the gear is up, etc.).
Will /Chicago /USA

Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers

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Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #16 on: Fri, 24 Jun 2022 09:38 »
Another option is to recognize that PSX was designed from the ground up for hardware cockpit support, but NOT for USB.

So the proper solution is to use an external program to listen to all USB events and then use this program to map the controls to PSX's network. Only code can solve this mapping challenge; trying to design a point and click interface powerful enough to support all present and future USB controls and all PSX controls is slightly out of scope of the product.

Of course this does not help you today.

And example would be the gear lever. An UP/DOWN lever will never properly simulate an UP/OFF/DOWN lever. But code can make it behave. When UP, the lever moves up, and when all proper conditions have been satisfied, it sends the OFF command underground. When DOWN, the code assures the lever of PSX is down no matter where it was. This kind of stuff is immensely difficult to pre-think for all possible combinations of USB controls out there.

Since all USB controls are designed with MSFS in mind, the problem exists uniquely for PSX and other less well known simulators, unfortunately.

Hoppie

Hardy Heinlin

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Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 24 Jun 2022 11:38 »
It appears the coder added the USB value for Flaps and Right Throttle to Line 140.  The Right Throttle was coded correctly to Line 140. Flaps should have been coded to Line 141 but it wasn't, it was coded to Line 140 in error.

The strange thing is the fact that these numbers are not set by a human coder but by an automatic iteration in the computer's USB management. The sequence of the numbers depends on the sequence of the devices that are plugged in. If you remove some other USB devices (for a test) you will have less than 140 parts, and then this particular number "140" will have no "code" meaning anymore. The flaps lever part will then use a different part number. And the problem will remain probably (as you wrote earlier). This is baffling me too. As it works in other Microsoft programs but not in this Java USB interface I assume it's a bug in that Java interface. But, as I said, I don't think it's related to a specific part number. Something very unusual must be triggering this. In fact, it's the first time in 15 years that I see such a double assignment. Regrettably, I can't provide any further help at the moment ...


Regards,

|-|ardy

Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers

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Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #18 on: Fri, 24 Jun 2022 13:14 »
Interestingly, if somebody would write the USB-to-PSX Bridge in Java using this same library, then the same problem should occur. Maybe it is useful to try this, if only as a device dumping one-shot program.


Hoppie

Hardy Heinlin

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Re: PFC Throttle Quadrant Issues
« Reply #19 on: Fri, 24 Jun 2022 13:39 »
I'm always trying to be 100% sure that it's not a fault in my code. Just got another idea regarding "equal name" check within an iteration. But I found no such check in my code. What I mean is this:

PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | slider; Dial;  (analog)
PFC Throttle Quadrant Console | Unknown | 0 | Unknown | slider; Slider;  (analog)


This time I don't mean the "slider; Slider;" thing within the same part. Now I mean the "slider" in the one part and the next slider in the next part. Maybe -- maybe -- the iteration puts the next slider's signal reference into the previous slider's reference because the previous type is also a "slider" (sort of "if equal do not iterate"). If this is really the cause, it should be reproducible in other cases where two sliders are listed one after the other. Does anyone have such a device? E.g. a 4-lever thrust quadrant? Are there 4 parts of the "slider" type?


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