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Author Topic: Video Card Selection  (Read 990 times)

Mariano

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 830
Video Card Selection
« on: Tue, 22 Feb 2022 23:58 »
Hi,

I have a laptop that has both an Nvidia and a “motherboard/onboard” Intel video card.

It seems that PSX only uses the Intel card. I cannot seem to make Nvidia the default card for PSX. Is this because PSX is not considered a “3D” application (whatever that means), whose system resources usage are too low to require the high-end card?

Even if PSX used the Nvidia card, would that make any difference in graphics quality?

Thank you,

Mariano

Will

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Location: Chicago
  • Posts: 2419
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #1 on: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 01:02 »
Only speaking from my own experience… moving from the onboard card to an NVIDIA card on my old desktop computer gave me a frame rate increase from about 40 (variable) up to a steady 73 fps. I didn’t see any other changes.

For what it’s worth, I think there was a setting in the NVIDIA setup app that I had to run to make it the default graphics card.
Will /Chicago /USA

Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers

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  • Location: KTMB
  • Posts: 4457
  • Hoppie designs avionics equipment for airliners.
    • http://www.hoppie.nl/
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 07:39 »
PSX technically is a 2D program even if it has some 3D appearance; there is no 3D model that is being rendered. The PSX flight deck is a 2D painting. Although there is some hardware support used for some of the painting operations, it is not a 3D engine and therefore it does not use available 3D hardware.


Hoppie

Cappa

  • Join date: Mar 2015
  • Location: Sydney
  • Posts: 7
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #3 on: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 09:49 »
Hi Mariano

I previously owned a Microsoft laptop that had an nvidia graphics
as well as an onboard graphics and if I recall the nvidia software would allow
you to set a program to use Nvidia or onboard graphics.

Regards

Joe

Mariano

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 830
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #4 on: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:58 »
Thanks guys.

I am going to look further in the software but, as suggested above, I fear it might only improve frames per second.

Best regards,

Mariano

asboyd

  • Join date: Jan 2012
  • Location: YSSY
  • Posts: 745
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 23 Feb 2022 21:34 »
Strangely enough, if you monitor your (Windows) machine with task manager, you will see several non-graphic system apps using the 3D GPU hardware.
Windows can actually assign the GPU to "assist" with higher end apps.

Even though PSX is not a 3D application java can use the GPU to help with number crunching and so the Nvidia card, with dedicated faster memory, should improve frame rates.

I am sure Linux can use the GPU in the same manner, not sure about MAC though as I have not had a great deal of recent hands on with it.... (well not since MAC II/III days...)

Cheers,
AlexB
Alex Boyd... Sydney, Australia

Mariano

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 830
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 17:02 »
Thanks, Alex.

Best regards,

Mariano

Panos Bilios

  • Join date: Jun 2014
  • Location: LGKR
  • Posts: 89
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 20:48 »
Hi Mariano,

I have a low end GPU , is  a gtx 650 , with a I3 processor and I was
getting 35-45 frames , then my  processor got burned due to a power surge
and I replaced it with an I7 with the same video card and my frames went up to 72
so it seems that PSX is using more processor power than video card.

Panos

 

Mariano

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 830
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 24 Feb 2022 23:06 »
Thanks for your input, Panos.

Best regards,

Mariano


United744

  • Join date: Oct 2014
  • Posts: 1044
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #9 on: Mon, 7 Mar 2022 16:43 »
I fear it might only improve frames per second.
It's only ever about increasing FPS!

Higher FPS = time per calculation is much lower, meaning more calculations per second, resulting in far higher fidelity of the flight model and a smoother experience. Higher FPS should always be the goal.

"Only FPS". LOL!

(I'm not laughing at you. I just find it humorous).

Mariano

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 830
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #10 on: Mon, 7 Mar 2022 18:29 »
I did not know that. I thought FPS only affected graphics “stutter”. Shows how much I know. 😂

I will go ahead and increase my PSX FPS setting.

Best regards,

Mariano

Hardy Heinlin

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  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 13156
    • Aerowinx
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #11 on: Mon, 7 Mar 2022 23:30 »
FPS is one quality factor. The other important factor is the frame rate stability.

Under the FPS indicator in PSX there's a green/magenta bar.

The longer the green part, the higher the FPS.

And: The more stable the green/magenta length, the more stutter-free the sim motion.

When the length is vibrating, there are micro stutters, even at high FPS.

Note that the FPS number is an average value, referring to the past 1000 milliseconds. Average means: There might be 60 frames during the first 200 ms, for example, and just 10 frames during the remaining 800 ms. Or whatever. The indicated number is just the sum of frames during the past 1 second.

Background info:

Every animation software (e.g. a sim) needs to know the computer time passed between frames. So before the software can reposition all moving objects further for the next frame, the software needs to measure the CPU milliseconds passed since the last frame. This measurement is used to calculate a time correction factor for the next frame. Without this correction, an aircraft that is supposed to move at 50 knots may actually move 30 or 69 knots in the sim, depending on the current CPU performance. When the CPU performance is low, the correction factor is high. A higher factor makes the motion jumps greater. (The digital world always jumps. You just won't notice the jumps when they are small enough.)

For instance, when you get 70 FPS, there will be 70 individual correction factors. 69 frames, for example, may have a duration of 14 milliseconds. And one frame, somewhere between the other 69, may last for 34 ms. -- 34 ms is not that bad. When all frames were 34 ms long, the FPS would be 30, which is still better than film.

But here's the logical problem: The software applies the correction factor to the next frame, not to the past frame which was the basis of the current correction calculation. The past is gone. The software needs to predict the CPU performance in the next frame. It assumes the performance will be equal to that of the past frame. This is no problem when the CPU performance fluctuates just slowly. It's a problem when the performance changes suddenly. The correction factor will be too inaccurate for a moment, and those 50 knots will appear like 30 or 69 kt in that one frame. That's a micro stutter. When the FPS thereafter remains low, but constant, the aircraft will immediately return to a steady 50 kt speed. The problem is just the sudden change of the CPU performance, as the software can only know the past, not the future. When you see a flicker on the green/magenta bar, that flicker is a micro stutter.

For example, a stable FPS of 40 might look better than an instable FPS of 70. You need to check both variables.


Regards,

|-|ardy

Mariano

  • Join date: May 2009
  • Posts: 830
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #12 on: Tue, 8 Mar 2022 16:37 »
Thank you for the very technical answer. The magenta/green line sectors relationship explanation was quite helpful. 

Best regards,

Mariano

GodAtum

  • Join date: Jun 2014
  • Posts: 865
Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 3 Jun 2022 21:59 »
PSX technically is a 2D program even if it has some 3D appearance; there is no 3D model that is being rendered. The PSX flight deck is a 2D painting. Although there is some hardware support used for some of the painting operations, it is not a 3D engine and therefore it does not use available 3D hardware.


Hoppie

Hi Hoppie, according to https://aerowinx.com/board/index.php?topic=5382.0, a GPU is quite important?

Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers

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  • Hoppie designs avionics equipment for airliners.
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Re: Video Card Selection
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 3 Jun 2022 22:36 »
Yes, but not the 3D part of a GPU, which is often the largest part on modern full-immersive gaming GPUs. PSX is a 2D program and only uses 2D accelleration hardware (when present).