Author Topic: WidePSX 2.5.6 : FSX, P3D and MSFS "2020" Compatible Scenery Generator (Read 59543 times)

dvflight1974 · « **Reply #480 on:** Sat, 24 Oct 2020 12:13 »

And perhaps there is a way to make the textures on these conversions PBR so we can enjoy reflections :-)

hunijjang · « **Reply #481 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 05:41 »

Quote from: funkyhut on Sat, 24 Oct 2020 10:01

If this post is out of order please let me know.

While J-P and Younghoon are working their magic, I thought I'd share the two conversions I have done. Credit and thanks to Younghoon for his blog post with the instructions on how to do this.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1XQJ-yVEILZThyfRsyB-kzK5OC0kwvl9B/view?usp=sharing

Here are two Posky 747-400 models. One is One World which has a cockpit view and the other is the WidePSX British Airways model without the cockpit and with unobstructed forward and side views. A Landor model is a WIP.

Drop the files into the MSFS community folder.

One World will appear as an airliner in the MSFS plane selection process and has an image in the selector. WidePSX will appear as Other and the selector is blank except for the name.

When the system.cfg (?) becomes available for operating the lights, you should be able to simply drop that over the existing file in both models.

Enjoy.

Hello

I feel very bad and embarrassed that you have done something about my blog post that I didn't tell you.

Whatever you see is your freedom, but I don't know how you found the article.
That is only for JP to check it out because he wanted it and I didn't ask others to see it.
Anyway, The article about the blog is only private.

Also, when you run MSFS Legacy Importer, there are at the bottom In the MSFS Legacy Importer said 'Do not publish imported aircraft without author permission(really, don't)' Alex Marko of Noticed!

Therefore, I think it is wrong to share the converted file.
Also, I am not an employee of WidePSX. So, I'm just one of his a customer.

There's something to be sure about.

At, first I tested it just for use only me and I didn't want to share anything about it with anyone.

I just wanted to tested it only personally but JP wanted to use it on WidePSX, how I converted and made the lights work.

I saw POSKY README.txt file in one of POSKY's B747-400 livery and Some of the contents there are as follows.

********** COPYRIGHT AND DISTRIBUTION **********

This aircraft is released as FREEWARE.

Copyright (C) Project OpenSky . All rights reserved.

**** MODELS or FDE's CANNOT BE MODIFIED, RECOMPILED or REDISTRIBUTED ****

-For painters please see our webpage we are open for paintings once a paintkit is released. You are not authorized to paint over an existing Project Opensky repaint unless granted permission by the respective texture artist. Our official reapaints are not copyright free you need to ask permission of the repainter if any of our repaint work is used.
-For any other changes you must ask permission to the Author.
-No charge may be made for this package
-This Aircraft may not be bundled with any other package ( freeware or payware )
-The use of this aircraft is at your own risk, the author cannot be held responsible.

According to this, it is all illegal to convert for MSFS or to change the cfg file for MSFS.
Also, MSFS legacy Importer application is can be used for personal purpose only.
So, At least, if anyone use it for WidePSX, I don't think it's only for personal use.

So I decided not to share what I changed for lights operation for the MSFS.

This means that I won't even release my guide.

As JP said, I worked very hard for this, but I stopped everything now.
However, this is not just a simply problem, so I can't do anything anymore.

Also, For personal reasons, I can no longer use of my time for this.

Best Regards,

Younghoon

JP59 · « **Reply #482 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 06:39 »

Hello,

I discover this last post Younghoon published without advising me first. I never shared Younghoon’s blog post with anybody, I don’t know how some persons get its link.

There are indeed copyright issues with the Posky models. But, even if WidePSX is a commercial application, it is not forbidden to use the Posky aircrafts with it. I precise as you know that Posky models were never sold with the WidePSX package, and that WidePSX can work with any aircraft in the Scenery Generator (even a Cessna). So I feel very relax about their copyright.

Testings work and the POSKY 747 in MSFS has all its moving parts and lights working. Now the issue is : how to share that ? I think Younghoon’s system.cfg file is HIS OWN creation, because this file doesn’t exists in the POSKY original package, so I don’t think there is any issue to broadcast this only single file to the community. But it will be his own decision. About the conversion process, it is not forbidden to share a « how to » guide.

Best regards
Jean-Philippe

funkyhut · « **Reply #483 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 08:12 »

Greetings Youghoon and J-P,
I'd be grateful if you would contact me by PM so that we can clear up what seems to be a small misunderstanding. It would be a pity if the community could not benefit from the great work you are doing.
Kindest,

Chris.

dvflight1974 · « **Reply #484 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 12:17 »

Cant we just find someone that can make the "shell" of the 747-400 that can be installed into MSFS with nice textures, working lights, and animations? I'm more than willing to pay for the aircraft addon!

JP59 · « **Reply #485 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 12:36 »

I am confident we will find a way to share our work with the community for free, and respect the POSKY copyright at the same time. Actually it seems to still have a problem with the lights. We tested with the aircraft stopped and it worked fine. But when the aircraft is moving we discovered that the NAV and STROBE lights are moving below the wing for an unknown reason. The other lights are remaining at the right position.

So still a long way to go but I am confident. I am trying to coordinate all our efforts to achieve something in a reasonable time. We are so close to get something really fantastic, I am convinced this is the way to go. We need to be a little bit more patient.

Best regards,
Jean-Philippe

dvflight1974 · « **Reply #486 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 13:47 »

Quote from: JP59 on Mon, 26 Oct 2020 12:36

I am confident we will find a way to share our work with the community for free, and respect the POSKY copyright at the same time. Actually it seems to still have a problem with the lights. We tested with the aircraft stopped and it worked fine. But when the aircraft is moving we discovered that the NAV and STROBE lights are moving below the wing for an unknown reason. The other lights are remaining at the right position.

So still a long way to go but I am confident. I am trying to coordinate all our efforts to achieve something in a reasonable time. We are so close to get something really fantastic, I am convinced this is the way to go. We need to be a little bit more patient.

Best regards,
Jean-Philippe

Look forward to it. If we also add in reflective textures etc that would be a nice touch

brian747 · « **Reply #487 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 15:57 »

Quote

I am confident we will find a way to share our work with the community for free, and respect the POSKY copyright at the same time.

I would like to warmly thank J-p and his collaborators for their excellent work on our behalf towards producing a fully-realised (and, hopefully, repaintable?) 744 puppet aircraft for MSFS. If only I had the relevant software skills I would gladly do what I could to assist, but sadly I cannot. So meanwhile I will be patient, as J-p suggests, and await the outcome.

But I have to admit that I was saddened by Younghoon's sudden decision not to share his guide (which surely cannot be covered by any copyright but his own?), and beyond that decline now to share the results of his work so far, citing the POSKY readme which (many years ago) forbade the models from being "modified, recompiled, or redistributed". Now that decision is obviously Younghoon's alone to make - however....

I am no lawyer, so what follows is simply my own opinion, but it appears to me that perhaps this may be an over-literal interpretation of the intent of that copyright notice? To explain why, allow me to briefly define my understanding of POSKY (Project OpenSky) and also of copyright - as applied to freeware, orphanware, or abandonware.

I will attempt to summarise POSKY, for the benefit of those whose memories of the simming scene don't extend back as far as my own, as follows. Project OpenSky aircraft was at its peak in the days of FS9 (FS2004). Some of the aircraft were ported, not always with complete success, into FSX, and indeed a successful port to P3D proved to be even more uncertain. This was a pity, since so many good-looking aircraft models were produced. But by 2010, Project OpenSky was in the process of dying (reputedly because the person who hosted the web site and provided other resources wished to pull out), and indeed by December 1st of that year the website was offline. All that remains of the POSKY models can nowadays be found on the "Project Opensky Archive" site at http://web.archive.org/web/20140625120530/http://poskyarchive.com/

The POSKY freeware, therefore, can presumably nowadays be categorised as orphanware or abandonware. So how might the relevant copyright rules apply now? In cases where a commercial software product is still being actively developed and sold - such as PSX, for example - it is very clear that copyright rules do apply and will be enforced, with the aim of ensuring that the software authors receive their legitimate rewards. So far, I'm fairly certain we all agree.

However, surely software which is or was freeware will only deploy copyright notices not with the intention of preventing financial loss (fairly obviously), but only in an attempt to prevent unauthorised or illicit distribution, in other words to guard against the heinous practice of other people re-publishing the work as their own, perhaps with minor modifications of dubious quality, and in the worst cases even trying to make money out of it. It seems pretty obvious to me that in the case of freeware any question of financial gain for the original authors cannot arise, which is why I feel that the standard rules applicable to commercial laws of copyright seem heavy-handed, and possibly even inapplicable in 2020 to freeware (and now, abandonware) aircraft models designed for use with FS2004.

But the real question in this case, it seems to me, is not so much one of legalities but moralities, and comes down to this: if we could ask the original authors of the POSKY model whether they would object to their model being modified for use with PSX (whilst still retaining all the original documentation and attributions of authorship) would they object? Well, who knows - but, considerably more than ten years on, if I were in their place and were asked that question my feeling would be that I would be happy to see my work given an extended lease of life rather than being forgotten (I provided it free in the first place, after all), and I would therefore give my permission gladly. Although others, I fear, may occasionally be less generous of spirit. And, sadly, after all this time the original author(s) can probably no longer be identified, let alone found (and indeed may no longer be active in the simming community).

It seems to be de facto the case that the freeware POSKY models are no longer being supported or developed. So in such a case, are we talking strict legalities, or what most people would regard as being morally acceptable?

All of which is a long-winded way of saying that I feel that the original intention of the POSKY copyright notice was in fact to prevent misuse or misappropriation - which in the present instance surely would not be the case.

YMMY, naturally.

Cheers,

Brian

Tércio Sampaio · « **Reply #488 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 18:33 »

First a big Thank You to J-p and all that could collaborate in the success of this software

Brian, I also think in the same way. Many times even with commercial old games is a mess of situation that you can't even contact devs anymore and when you have the luck of found one the classic replies are: they can't do nothing because the copyrights was in the hands of companies that no more exist.

Many times it enter into the limbo and in a black hole on the copyrights. Also to add more things, even DMCA allows reengineer and changes of the software to allow it working in modern systems when the devs are already abandoned it (like crackers and nocd versions to allow it working).

Also another situation is: copyright only rules when the company actively act defending it, if they goes to passively do nothing (and as you can see tons of posky 747 downloads and versions spread on the internet in different websites) the copyright start to fade because enter into what its like a abandoned copyright and the use, if not for bad situations or commercial advantage of it, it starts to enter into the "fair use" situation were copyrights can't do much/nothing.
I know that copyrights sometimes are acted and followed with paranoia but in some cases exist some exceptions were the copyright rules can't be so religiously followed…

I also agree, were is the posky developers? they still exist or be alive? Maybe yes, maybe no…

Another thing and for sure is not a copyright issue, if someone post that in the file X you need to change the line Y from 234.6 to 6754.8.

So i not see any the end of the world if someone explain what changes need to be made on the cfg file to put the lights working.

Regards

P.S.: I'm not a lawyer, all this is from my big experience reading many copyrights rules and contacting many old developers and companies of very old pc games. Its so shady that even exist old companies that avoid to talk about it, they can't do nothing now, its a full abandoned software and thats all.

garys · « **Reply #489 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 19:27 »

Yep, too much drama over this. Mountain out of a mole hill. thanks for the your effort JP and Younghoon but this is stupid. I'm out. Have fun!

Tércio Sampaio · « **Reply #490 on:** Mon, 26 Oct 2020 21:00 »

If you go to x-plane.org the biggest x-plane community forum on web, you see explanations on how to improve multiple addons in terms of instructions to change the files to get the things better on 100s of paywares and no one are making a copyright war.
Posky 747 are available on multiple websites to get, i don’t see any copyright issue a tutorial explaining of how to get it working on msfs. It was already converted from community to fsx and also improved it.
See this example:
https://flyawaysimulation.com/downloads/files/6391/fsx-posky-boeing-747-400-virtual-cockpit/
and that is only the tip of the iceberg, avsim and flyawaysimulation, have 1000s of mods and changes to posky addons and for sure almost all have and contain parts of posky original addon.

Aside, manytimes its stupidly annoying to see how softwares devs and users behave so weird in terms or copyrights, rights, laws, etc....
If I buy a Ford Mustang (or whatever other brand/model), and its a paid product! I will not be processed/attacked by the brand because I use the car in my living room as a furniture, because it was not the original vision of the brand when build that car. I’m not doing nothing criminal neither commercial advantage of it and no one will go to prison because publish an article on how to insert the car inside the house and use the car to store my books.

JP59 · « **Reply #491 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 08:30 »

Hello,

It is time for me to thank publicly Younghoon for his short collaboration. He came to me with the idea to help the community but suddenly faced a kind of scare regarding the Project Opensky copyright. Despite my explanations regarding how copyright works and the actual abandoned status of Project Opensky he decided to give up and to not share his discoveries with us. This choice is difficult to understand and came suddenly but we all have to respect it.

I have a deep respect for all the members of our PSX family, not only for the WidePSX customers. I realize how ridiculous this story became this last two days and I want to apologize for sharing my (too) great enthusiasm regarding the recent discoveries. I am not only the seller of WidePSX. I am an aviation enthusiast first, and a daily user of PSX, MSFS and WidePSX. I am also (I hope) a member of this family and wanted to share my enthusiasm with you, nothing more.

Regards,
Jean-Philippe

Tércio Sampaio · « **Reply #492 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 10:03 »

And this one that is already for msfs2020?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QAJvujmP9mU

It works nice with WidePSX (lights)?
We need only to disable the 3d cockpit thats easy

GodAtum · « **Reply #493 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 10:48 »

Quote from: Tércio Sampaio on Tue, 27 Oct 2020 10:03

And this one that is already for msfs2020?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QAJvujmP9mU

It works nice with WidePSX (lights)?
We need only to disable the 3d cockpit thats easy

Interesting, how would I get the 2D no panel view like normal?

Tércio Sampaio · « **Reply #494 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 10:57 »

Tonight i will do many tests with this addon and recently bought WidePSX, then i will share here my findings...

JP59 · « **Reply #495 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:20 »

Hi,

Of course it does the job and can be a workaround for some days if you can’t wait more. But what some people are trying to achieve is far beyond this default FSX aircraft. Guys, we are PSX. We deserve gorgeous dizains of liveries of worldwide companies. We deserve a cristal clear forward empty view to shoot the runway « fingers in the nose ». Do you want to fly economy with World Travel Airlines ? Or do you want to fly first class, drinking Champagne, eating Caviar with gorgeous busty flight attendants ?

I’m out now. Going back to the background work, printing your first class tickets. Boarding will open sooner than you expect.

PS : I hope everybody will understand the humorous tone of this post. After all this drama I think we all need some fun !

Cheers !!!
Jean-Philippe

funkyhut · « **Reply #496 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 12:37 »

Hi Tércio,

You probably saw this:
https://flyawaysimulation.com/downloads/files/3365/fsx-boeing-747-400-multi-textures-package/

They work but my feeling is the modeling is not as sharp as Posky. They are also already dds.

Look forward to your test report.

airlinejets · « **Reply #497 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 14:40 »

Quote from: JP59 on Tue, 27 Oct 2020 11:20

Going back to the background work, printing your first class tickets. Boarding will open sooner than you expect.

Thanks Jean-Philippe. I'm looking forward to what you are preparing for us.

Michel

Tércio Sampaio · « **Reply #498 on:** Tue, 27 Oct 2020 18:05 »

Quote from: funkyhut on Tue, 27 Oct 2020 12:37

Look forward to your test report.

Because I saw that caviar will arrives soon, soooooo i will wait then…
Thanks Jean-Philippe!

GodAtum · « **Reply #499 on:** Wed, 28 Oct 2020 22:30 »

For those using the current 747-8 model, you can adjust the camera.cfg file, instructions are here: https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/forward-view-no-instrument-solution-plus-walkaround-for-every-plane/197291/28

This moves the internal camera further forward then the in-built options. My values are:

Code: [Select]

InitialXyz= 0.130001, 1.099998, 5.849985