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Audio in PSX

Started by Phil Bunch, Thu, 19 Jun 2014 17:37

Phil Bunch

What should we expect regarding audio quality and options in PSX?

Blu-Ray DVDs have spoiled me as they usually provide 7-channel DTS-ES audio with bass sometimes extending into the infrasonic!  Some movies, like the first 20 minutes of "Saving Private Ryan" are at risk of causing nosebleeds and permanent hearing losses when a (simulated) mortar shell explodes nearby!  As I tell my partner, "if your ears aren't bleeding after a war movie, you don't have the sound turned up enough!"  So far, she hasn't agreed, so I don't play such movies or certain organ music recordings while she's home.  

It's interesting that if one turns off the video in action movies, they still seem very real, but if you turn off the sound, they no longer seem very real.  I found that with PS1 even having a background drone of jet engines while in flight contributed to the experience of "suspended disbelief" that is characteristic of many computer-based simulations as well as movies.

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Other comments:

Large jet engines can create sound levels well into the permanent hearing damage level, and of course we'll need to simulate the sound of our aircraft exploding and/or the sounds of jet engines exploding...of course this would require that the user will hook his PC up to a high-powered audio system, probably using S/PDIF and/or HDMI for transmitting the audio data to the audio system.

Best wishes,

Phil Bunch

Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers

Hardy has been a recording studio sound engineer for the other half of his life. Does that give you a hint?


Hoppie

the mad hatter

#2
for warning sounds etc I just go the box from the aircraft and use the base systems as is

Phil Bunch

Great news!

Maybe I need to buy bigger subwoofers??  Here's an interesting model that got a favorable reviews in Stereophile magazine:

http://velodyne.com/subwoofers/digital-drive-plus-series/digital-drive-plus-18.html

With 3000 watts peak power and an 18-inch speaker, a 40-pound speaker magnet, a frequency response down to 14 Hz, and 115 dB output, this should be adequate for most purposes, especially if you have at least two of them installed.  Still, I think I recall that a big jet engine creates up to 180 dB in the region behind the engine while it's running.  

Thus, maybe this is the type of audio system we need to recreate the real audio from a real 747:

"A car stereo that can kill you? Cool"

http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/ptech/07/02/popsci.stereo.kill/

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With my own less extravagant home theater system (2 15-inch subwoofers, 1000 watts each, plus 5 other smaller powered subwoofers  in speakers installed around the room), I've noticed that bass below a certain frequency range is mostly sensed by one's skin and one's lungs.  A sudden explosive sound, as from an action movie, resonates in your lungs and creates a tactile sensation that is hard to describe.  These sensations are somehow very convincing that you really experienced a nearby explosion!
Best wishes,

Phil Bunch

Will

#4
I don't have a surround-sound speaker system with speakers that endanger my life, but I can confidently say that the PSX experience with headphones is immersive and exceptional, and with a good audio system should be excellent. Most general cockpit sounds are provided in well-mixed stereo, while certain other items can be selected to the left audio channel, the right channel, or both. Again, it's a well-executed and immersive experience.
Will /Chicago /USA

ahaka

PS1 sure had a very good audio for the time.

I wonder if PSX will also provide those extremely low frequency sounds for things like subwoofers or buttkickers. There should be some punishment for making a hard landing. :D
Antti

Hardy Heinlin

Quote from: ahakaI wonder if PSX will also provide those extremely low frequency sounds ...
It does.

ahaka

Quote from: Hardy Heinlin
Quote from: ahakaI wonder if PSX will also provide those extremely low frequency sounds ...
It does.

That's great, Hardy! I had a feeling it would do that. :)
Antti

GodAtum

I saw a screenshot showing callouts and FO options.

Can sounds be routed separately through speakers and a headset?

evaamo

Is the same sound environment used for all engine variant or does PSX use different sound sets for each type? Of course I won't complain if it's the same soundset... but it's worth asking ;-)

cheers
-Enrique
Enrique Vaamonde

Hardy Heinlin

In a network, you can use the audio output of computer A for the observer's headset, for example, and the audio output of computer B for the MAWEA speakers, for example.

For example. Just for example.

Engine sounds are mixes of multiple sound files. GE & PW are identical. RR has special  nuances in the lower frequency band. The upper "whining" frequencies are similar, though. But that again depends on the engine specific RPM values of each engine.


Cheers,

|-|ardy

Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers

#11
I am pretty sure that Hardy could produce three articles for sound engineering journals on how he achieved the immersive stereo mix for PSX... these things go quite beyond dumping WAV files out.

And the same for visual effects in Java.


Hoppie

Hardy Heinlin

#12
:-) Yeh.

One important thing to consider is the problem when multiple sine waves, for example the low frequency rumble of four independent engines, have a slightly different frequency. This cause interferences. Especially in the lower band because the wave lengths are so long.

Musicians know that when they tune their instruments, and two tones are slightly mistuned, that this two-tone mix causes a tremolo effect due to interferences. The tremolo gets slower when the two frequencies get closer to each other.

With four engines, with slightly different RPMs, the mix of the four "bass tones" would cause a permanent tremolo effect. Rumble-rum-rum-rum... Therefore, in PSX, the bass mix of all four engines is one compact stereo wall-of-sound whose pitch and volume is computed in the PSX code. Only the high pitch whine sounds are separated and individual to each engine as there are nearly no interference problems in the higher frequency band. If you listen carefully, when you notice the four-voice-whine-choir is not quite at the same pitch, you will know something's wrong with one of the engines ... :-) Hear the engine problem come ...


|-|

Shiv Mathur

I know this has been said a hundred times before, but that one single post leaves me in awe.

You've thought of every damn single little thing !!!

Phil Bunch

#14
These discussion is very exciting for people with an interest in audio quality, etc.

As anyone who tries to add very low-frequency sounds to a room in a home with normal dimensions and construction, room resonances soon become an issue that needs to be addressed.  Thus, I would think that the lower frequencies of PSX may need to be modified by the hardware/software of one's subwoofer system in order to prevent excessive and unrealistic resonances.  I've never thought about this issue with respect to 747 sounds, but some types of music  as well as war movies will trigger these issues.

Hmmm....maybe I need to consider upgrading my subwoofers?  The best new  subwoofers come with microphones and hardware or software to address room resonance issues.  I've tried to figure out what these things are doing and I *think* it may be as simple as notch-filtering the primary resonance frequencies of one's audio environment.   I think I remember correctly that add-on anti-resonance boxes are also available to insert between the audio source and the subwoofer.

Much depends on how intense and how frequently the PSX sound fields extend into room resonance frequencies, etc, etc.
Best wishes,

Phil Bunch

GodAtum

Just thinking about what speakers to use for the engines. I could make use of my home cinema speakers (Monitor Audio) or just my Logitech z5500.

evaamo

This is great information, thanks Hardy / Hoppie for your replies. The more we learn about the great stuff in PSX the harder it is to wait for it!!!

I didn't know about Hardy being a professional sound engineer until a few days ago, that sure raises the bar on the expectations with regards to the sound environment. But in terms of his software development skills... what he has done using just Java 2D is something worth of an award!!!

BTW, maybe it's time to release a video or two as teasers? ;-)

cheers
-Enrique
Enrique Vaamonde

Hardy Heinlin

Quote from: evaamoBTW, maybe it's time to release a video or two as teasers? ;-)
Yes, it's time!

I just don't know where to start :-)


Cheers,

|-|ardy

CarlBB

Please bear in mind that the 12973 views of the alpha version 55 currently on Youtue are probably down to a few people on here  :)  Me? No not I, I think I watched it once, maybe twice :lol:
Carl

Kurt

Quote from: CarlBBPlease bear in mind that the 12973 views of the alpha version 55 currently on Youtue are probably down to a few people on here  :)  Me? No not I, I think I watched it once, maybe twice :lol:
Carl

Hehe yes I definately have my share of those 12973 views :)

Btw if it is time for new videos - can we asume that beta testing have ended and DVD production is next?

BR

Kurt
Best regards
Kurt