WXR/TERR raster image anti-alias

[Hardy Heinlin]

Good evening,

I need more space on the Instructor > Preferences pages.

On Instructor > Preferences > Basics there is an option called "WXR/TERR anti-alias". It makes the weather radar image and terrain map image on the ND smoother. However, this option only works on Windows and Linux; I have disabled it for the Mac because since Mac Java 1.7 it reduces the frame rate by 80%.

This option is not realistic anyway as the real ND has no WXR/TERR anti-alias either; especially the terrain image on the real ND looks rather "pixelated".

I would like to remove this option so that all platforms (not just the Mac) get the more realistic "non-anti-alias" style image, and better frame rates too.

Is anybody insisting on keeping this option?


Regards,

|-|ardy


Please note: I will not change the ND graphics system in PSX. My question is just about that anti-alias option.

[tango4]

Personally, I do use this option.
The way it is drawn on the screen in PSX is not "realistic" with or without this option, but I prefer the antialias look, which I feel is a bit closer to the real thing (especially for WX radar).
But as you mentioned somewhere, it is drawn that way in PSX for technical reasons that are perfectly understandable.
Nevertheless, I do prefer the antialias, but that is only a single opinion.

Charles

[Avi]

What NAV DB do you have?
Hardy changed this system in 10.0.8 (the way it looks like in the ND) but it works only with the latest NAV DB.

Cheers,

[vito]

To me antialiased terrain and radar looks "better" and I dont see any negative effect on framerate. Can it stay as option?

Best regards

Vito

[tango4]

No, I do have the update you mention.
My post above was indeed perhaps misleading.
The radar returns SIMULATION seems pretty darn realistic.
What I meant was more,about the visual "feel".  You could imagine that as the equivalent of a font. For example, the CDU could have the wrong font (so it would not "feel" right) while being realistic in its features. It is just an example to explain, of course the font is correct in PSX !
I think Hardy acknowledged that the visual look was not perfect for technical reasons (to keep high frame rates especially in networked sessions where you have to synchronize the drawings). And I also think that explains Hardy's remark at the end of the post !

If you are curious as to what I mean I think PMDG got that right on their 777. Just look for EGPWS screenshots on Google,and you'll see that.

[Hardy Heinlin]

OK, I keep the option.

[United744]

I think I'm running 1.8 on the Mac, and notice no degredation with it enabled. 80% drop in perf is huge. I think I have seen this on previous Java builds though (sounds familiar).

I also agree it looks better with it on.

If you were to remove the option, hard-wire it ON.

[G-CIVA]

If you are curious as to what I mean I think PMDG got that right on their 777. Just look for EGPWS screenshots on Google,and you'll see that.

I have to disagree here - & please do not take my comments personally.

I don't think that the above 'Dev' has it right inside the FSX/p3D iteration of the 777 & if this is to be used as a basis to simulate what is displayed on the ND of a 744 I an not so certain at all.  Personally I have never ticked the WXR/TERR raster image anti-alias; I prefer the much more 'pixelated' effect & I present several real world 'exhibits' that I would hope would prove my reasoning .....

We really need some RW input from Jon or Peter here really; I have no RW experience so in all probability like the next person I could be wrong. 

If it helps Hardy to make space by removing the option then I say do it ... is it poll time again?

Exhibit A - Terr In Peaks Mode

https://youtu.be/v8xFaJ_-Re4?t=55s

Exhibit B - Terr In Peaks Mode

https://youtu.be/MKIoiD8nkwo?t=45s

Exhibit C - WXR + T Mode

https://youtu.be/USh_zuH4J7s?t=6m30s

Exhibit D - WXR + T Mode

https://youtu.be/TImK-oNY6-s?t=50s

[tango4]

I see what you mean.
Regarding the WX radar, especially since update 10.0.8 the simulation is indeed impressive. (And the aforementioned developer does not simulate all the masking effects and so on). Plus I think it is not simulating the same radar.
But the "texture" from what I see on those videos looks better on the other addon for the terrain mode. I know it is supposed to look pixelated but in a certain way.
I have the feeling that the real one looks A BIT like something between the antialiased version and the regular one.
But once again it is just one opinion (so possibly wrong of course). And just one vote. No drama if the option is removed.

Nevertheless

[tango4]

To show you what I mean in video A go to 2:26. The yellow area on the ND is not "solid" yellow but has a certain texture.
But nevertheless we are talking about a small detail, and a detail where individual perception must play a part.

All the best.

Charles

[jtsjc1]

Also if the ND is an LCD it should have a better resolution than a CRT. Maybe that's the reason it looks different on the 777. I agree Hardy did an impressive job when he updated the WX radar.

[United744]

The weather/terrain display is drawn using blocks, rather than pixels. See the following.

http://www.meriweather.com/flightdeck/747/center/ndcapt.jpg

[G-CIVA]

That picture is not a valid image - its been 'touched up'.

Another RW source - WX Radar - B744 with LCDs ... I still maintain Hardy has it right ...

https://youtu.be/I4CnKTXNqAg?t=3m35s

Terr Display - B744 with LCDs

https://youtu.be/7g0xL88ebXs?t=3m40s

[Hardy Heinlin]

I keep the option.


|-|ardy

[andrej]

Hey guys,

Little late to the discussion, but better then never.

I came across this video, where it shows detail of the TERR on F/O ND.

DLH 744:
https://youtu.be/ip_bSgcfd1Y?t=3m12s

and DLH 748i:

https://youtu.be/tmnEi28FeI4?t=1m48s

Cheers,

[Lashrathius]

Hey all,

I've seen a couple of replies on the "texture" of the real display of the TERR -

They are drawn using "dots". It is pretty much a coloured dot-pattern representing the surrounding terrain; it has a dot pattern so pilots wouldn't mistaken it for the WXR.

See a very high res picture of the dot pattern here: http://www.airlinereporter.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/EGPWS_Screen-B737.jpg

Yes, I know it's a 737, but the 744 Collins LCD version has the exact same output. The CRT's dots are slightly smaller.

[EDIT] - see below. there are actually differences in the Collins LCD from the Honeywell LCD, but same concept of a dot pattern.

Personally, I think the non-anti-aliased option is PSX's closest representation to the real thing.

Regards,
- Henry

[John H Watson]

A 747-400 Terrain display "up close"...

http://www.iinet.net.au/~b744er@ozemail.com.au/PSX/TerrainCloseup.jpg