Flying with 2 eng out

[isaaclevi]

Hi Hardy,

I learnt from Sabena and CAE (Brussels) during all my simulator sessions (ATR72/42,B733CL, B763ER ) something simple: dead engine dead foot , you apply force on opposite rudder and keep wings level (bank angle less than 5°) and then you ruddertrim to relief your effort ( it assumes you follow the engine out track  ) and then A/P ON.
In flightsim desktop (my opinion ) it is impossible to reproduce or feel this force, but I think  you can translate this necessary force into something visible( maybe ) in the screen and then applying ruddertrim to compensate after. I hope it will help.

Cheers

isaaclevi
FMMI

[cagarini]

Interesting read:

FlightLab Notes on Directonal Stability

from here:

And as always. this chapter of "See How it Flies...":

But above all, it is important to note that the use of rudder only to counter asymmetric thrust creates a sideforce, and thus the path will always be curved towards the dead engine(s) side. Bank into the "live side" will be required to cancel this force and fly without sideslip, hence, the ball will always have to deflect ( due to gravity )  a bit towards the "live side".

[Alex]

Ok gents,
This is from Boeing FCTM:

Rudder and Lateral Control

This familiarization is performed to develop proficiency in handling the airplane
with an engine(s) inoperative. It also helps to gain insight into rudder control
requirements.
Under instrument conditions the instrument scan is centered around the attitude
indicator. Roll is usually the first indication of an asymmetric condition. Roll
control (ailerons) should be used to hold the wings level or maintain the desired
bank angle. Stop the yaw by smoothly applying rudder at the same rate that thrust
changes. When the rudder input is correct, very little control wheel displacement
is necessary. Refine the rudder input as required and trim the rudder so the control
wheel remains approximately level.
When the rudder is trimmed to level the control wheel, the airplane maintains
heading. A small amount of bank toward the operating engines may be noticeable
on the bank indicator. The slip/skid indicator is displaced slightly toward the
operating engines.
If the airplane is trimmed with too much control wheel displacement, full lateral
control is not available and spoilers on one wing may be raised, increasing drag.
Make turns at a constant airspeed and hold the rudder displacement constant. Do
not attempt to coordinate rudder and lateral control in turns. Rudder pedal inputs
produce roll due to yaw and induce the pilot to counter rudder oscillations with
opposite control wheel.
If an engine(s) failure occurs with the autopilot engaged, manually position the
rudder to approximately center the control wheel and add thrust. Trim the rudder
to relieve rudder pedal pressure.

Regards,
Alex

[400guy]

Some years ago an airline (which will not be named ) had an incident where a 747 lost an engine on take off westbound from KSFO.

The pilot DID NOT use the rudder properly and had enough aileron in that the spoilers were extended on one side.  The result was that the airplane flew out "the gap" in the hills west of the airport at very low altitude (one estimate was that it was within a wingspan of the hills!).

Got a lot of folks attention, particularly one of the tower controllers who happened to live out there!!

[400guy]

An additional comment on that incident.

They also did not follow the charted procedure for an engine failure on those (28) runways.  Take a look at them and consider how you are going to follow them.  A good idea to give that some thought before you start the take off!

[400guy]

I thought that I should clarify that the procedure I was talking about is a company one, not an FAA one.  Don't know if other airlines use it or something like it.

It is to track the runway center line out to the 2 dme of the sfo vor, then a right turn to 310 degrees to intercept the 294 radial of the sfo vor and fly it outbound.

No turns below 1500 ft.

The accel alt is 800 ft.

If you don't brief for the chance if an engine failure just after V1, you are likely to get to practice this on a check ride!

(The company liked to make things easy for us!)