Do you pull back on thrust levers? Even when the A/T is engaged.

[vnangli]

Situation is you have captured the G/S.

You are at a particular flap setting and wanting to increase the flaps. You change the SPEED in the MCP to match the flap setting speed indicated on the speed tape.

However, if the airplane is slow in slowing down (speed vector not seen yet) to the new speed and you dont want to use SPOILERS/SPEED BRAKES, is it a safe/good practice to pull down on the thrust levers while the A/T is still engaged? So that, you can let the A/T takeover once you are confident that the flap speed would be achievable.

This is a flight simmer's question. I was trying to understand if the pilots are advised either to use or not to operate the thrust levers when A/T is still engaged.

[Will]

I've never flown a 744, but it seems to me that it's best to never fight against the automation. Instead, program the automation to deliver the flight path you want, ideally in a mode with as many protections as possible.

[IefCooreman]

If this is a GS, you know the cause is usually aerodynamics and the aircraft will not slow down even when you pull the throttles back. Your initial reaction might be to pull, but you know the A/T will follow with the same command, and it will not change anything. So you either put the gear down, or pull the speedbrakes. Throttles will not change anything.

However if it is a question about automation efficiency, if the automation is not giving what you want, you intervene. I've pulled back throttles a couple of times in cruise with high CI to avoid overspeeds, even though the FCTM says the automation is intelligent enough and will correct it.

However, the reason is I want to avoid having to write this down in the techlog or having to write a report on an overspeed if it can be avoided, and having to make some phonecalls to explain. I'm a pilot, I'm lazy and don't want to miss breakfast at the hotel.

The reasoning is different in case of smoke or non-explosive emergency descent, where the techlog will be full anyway and the FCTM again says overspeeds are no problem (I believe on some Boeings you can have 30kts overspeed before any inspection is required, maintenance can walkaround and sign-off)

[Britjet]

Vnangli,

No, you don't fight the thrust levers in a position like this. As Ief says it won't make any difference anyway, and it could be that the automatics know something that you don't!
Holding them back just makes an irritating whine against the clutches - they definitely don't like to be held!
On later Boeing's like the 777 and 787, which of course usually have autothrottle engaged throughout, it is necessary to have quite a light hand in the levers on approach, as it is easier to override them accidentally.
Peter

[vnangli]

If this is a GS, you know the cause is usually aerodynamics and the aircraft will not slow down even when you pull the throttles back. Your initial reaction might be to pull, but you know the A/T will follow with the same command, and it will not change anything. So you either put the gear down, or pull the speedbrakes. Throttles will not change anything.

Yes this was in the GS... I was about 15 knots over the flap speed. In the PSX situation, I pulled the thrust levers (while A/T was still engaged)  and was able to achieve the speed indicated on the speed tape. That's when I realized if this was the right way to deal with the overspeed without using speedbrakes....

Its my mistake, I should have noted if I had a pitch down attitude or not...

I've never flown a 744, but it seems to me that it's best to never fight against the automation. Instead, program the automation to deliver the flight path you want, ideally in a mode with as many protections as possible.