NG FMS -vs- Legacy box

[Icarus747]

All of the aircraft at my company (and all future aircraft) are being updated with the NG FMS.  In fact we only have 1 aircraft left with the legacy box.  Is there any plan to make this an option for PSX?  The new box will do everything the old one will plus some really cool new stuff.  I've built this simulator to learn the aircraft, but not having an NG box is kind of a bummer.

[Hardy Heinlin]

There is a plan, and I'm in touch with two airlines that want to update PSX with the new FMS. However, I don't know when I can start the development -- if at all (I need some descriptions, otherwise I can't develop a model of it).


|-|

[Markus Vitzethum]

Just out of curiosity ... what are the differences between the original FMS (after FANS I) and the NextGen FMS? Is there a summary what the NextGen box can do differently or additionally? I assume that it is the same NG FMS used in the 747-8i/8F?

I am aware of the sigificantly increased memory size from 1 MegaWord to 50 MegaWords ( https://www.mitre.org/sites/default/files/pdf/12_1324.pdf )

Markus

[andrej]

Dear Markus,

on Honeywell's website I have found following table.

https://aerospace.honeywell.com/en/products/cockpit-systems/next-generation-flight-management-systems

Some NG FMS features:

* Flight Planning on Multiple Flight Plans
* Adaptable Modular Architecture
* Vectors-to-Final Approaches    
* First Principles Predictions optimized for future Air Traffic Management (ATM) functionality

Cheers,

[Icarus747]

I can certainly get you the manual Hardy.  Maybe even out setup/differences checklist.

[jb747]

Does anyone have a pic of the new FMC that you could post?

Thanks.

Jon

[Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers]

It looks quite the same as most other avionics LRUs, about this:

[John H Watson]

Actually, it's 3 times as big as that and gold in colour 

FMC photo

[andrej]

Actually, it's 3 times as big as that and gold in colour 

FMC photo

Interesting! And how are the CDU pages different from the Legacy CDU? Is the keyboard layout any different?

Cheers,

[Markus Vitzethum]

... or to put it in other words ... is the 747-400 NG box identical to the NG FMS used in the 747-8? (disregarding performance data, of course)

Markus

[Hardy Heinlin]

Meanwhile I got the chance to look into all the details of the NG system. As I wrote in another thread, the new system does not only replace the entire FMS, it also introduces new EFIS features, especially on the ND.

This is really a lot of development work. No joke!

Honestly, I cannot guarantee that PSX will ever get a complete model of the entire NG system.

Should it ever happen, it will take at least two years, I guess.


Regards,

|-|ardy

[Markus Vitzethum]

Is there any chance to talk about more details?

I am aware that the 747-8 with NG FMS does some things differently on the ND, but what is changed when retrofitting an NG FMS to the 747-400?

I also wonder if only the FMS box changes or are the MCDUs changed as well? So far I don't find any photos on the net showing anything different than the green colour font CDU. (The MCDU in the -8 has white fonts and I think some information is colour coded.)

Markus

[skelsey]

Hi Markus,

There are undoubtedly others here who will know far more about it than I, and it may well be something which is airline-specific, but certainly at BA I gather the CDUs themselves remain the old units with green writing; it is just the software which has changed.

[Hardy Heinlin]

Hi Skelsey,

that's interesting. Are you sure BA has not replaced the CDUs?

What about BA's PFD and ND? No change either? The NG system requires higher resolutions on the deviation indications -- for RF legs etc., and many other things.

Maybe some airlines are upgrading the FMCs only (not the CDUs and the IDS). I'm wondering what the others are doing -- Atlas Air, Kalitta etc. (The standard documents describe the full package anyway.)


|-|ardy

[Gary Oliver]

Hardy,

I am 99.999999% certain that the FMCs have been updated and the CDUs are exactly the same 1980s units.  Did you see my email with pictures I sent a few months back?  They were taken by a friend in BA Engineering on the flightdeck of a BA Jumbo just about to depart on scheduled services.

However I have no information on EIU updates.  I will ask a friend to see if we can dig out more.

Cheers
Gary

[Hardy Heinlin]

I got the pics now, Gary. Thanks! (Looks like the mail before was sent to a non-existent mail address.)


Cheers,

|-|ardy

[Britjet]

At least one of the BA 747 sims has NG software now. The CDU is the legacy one with green text. I imagine they will be looking to update the other sims as well..
I'm not sure if there is any difference on the flight instrumentation. I didn't notice one..
Peter

[Hardy Heinlin]

Is the NG upgraded BA 744 fleet certified to fly RF legs? I'm asking because the NG FMC can handle RF legs and this would be one of the advantages of the upgrade; but I think this advantage is disabled if the EFIS doesn't provide those additional indications.


|-|ardy

[Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers]

MCDUs are MCDUs. You can feed a green CRT 739A data that contains colours and it will just ignore them. The more modern LCD ones just display more text effects but the control protocol is the same and so are the keys.


Hoppie

[Jeroen Hoppenbrouwers]

Is the NG upgraded BA 744 fleet certified to fly RF legs?

It may be that BA "just" went for upgraded FMCs only because they truly needed the extended database memory but did not specifically need the other gimmicks?


Hoppie