want the aerowinx psx but first a few questions, could you help me out?

[florismulock]

Hi all,

i am Floris, 28 years old and have pmdg 747 737 and 777. 

I am very impressed by the psx.  even lightning strikes are simulated i read in an older post on this forum.
unfortunally i cant find enough information about this sim so i was hoping this community can help me out with my questions.

i understand that all the systems are simulated but is the air dynamics simulated as the real deal aswell/ does the aircraft behave in flight the same (nearly the same it is a simulated after all) as the real airplane?  cause i want the real deal, as close as possible to the real airplane. for instance does the wind effect the plane realistic?

about the emergences this sim can simulated> hows does this work, is there a list of all the errors in the simulation so i can click for instance on engine fire?  or does it work different

can i land this aircraft for instance in sea for an emergency without getting the fsx(flight simulator x) crash error when i hit the sea?  can the landing gear brake when the landing is too rough and is that simulated (with that i mean that the aircraft will drop on the runway) or does the sim just say crash.

if you compare this with pmdg 747 in flight dynamics, this is more realistic?

how is the weather in this sim?  i understand you can make your own weather but how realistic (with that i mean wind, icing etc )  is this?  forinstance if i dont put deicing on, (on the ground)  will this effect the run way lenght the plane need to take off or even that the airplane wont take off (there where plane accidents with deicing failures in the past during take off)

how is the viewing abbility is it possible to use a button so you can navigate to all the screens?  and is 1 screen possible?

Could you help me with these questions?  thanks a lot for taking the time!!!!

Floris

[cagarini]

1) FLIGHT DYNAMICS:

Aerowinx flight dynamics model is a custom made one, instead of one based on a generic flight simulation platform as provided by MSFS and derivates, or X-Plane for that matter... This means that although a similar approach to what is used in MSFS / P3D is adopted as flight dynamics engine ( the only example being the Majestic Q-400, based on JSBsim ), the parameters used in the simulation must have been carefully adapted to the simulation of a Boeing 747-400, instead of generic.

This has consequences in many aspects of the "feel" of flight you get from PSX, compared to any FSX / P3D add-on, unless that add-on uses an external flight dynamics engine. There are countless examples of how PSX feels, showing a level of detail and matching to the real 744 ( as noted by some rw 744 drivers who are PSX users ) that can simply not be achieved within FSX.

2) WEATHER:

PSX comes with a custom "World Scale Weather model", that while allowing for rw observations ( METAR ) to be fetched from the internet and integrated into that global weather model, is way more complex and detailed in the way it simulates weather than any combination of FSX own or injected weather, with the exception of the graphics, which apart from graphic "visibility patches" seen through the representation of the (front) windshield of the cockpit, are inexistent.

Simulation of turbulence, shear, microbursts, up and down drafts, together with the excellent flight dynamics, and the fluid display can make you sweat on an approach under adverse weather, like nothing you could ever experience in FSX or X-Plane with their best add-ons.

Flying next to convective clouds in PSX is a true example of why rw pilots avoid such cloud formations. The weather radar, which perfectly matches it's rw counterparts, integrates perfectly with the weather being generated around the aircraft, providing a unique experience and learning tool.

But in fact, users who have the necessary resources, like multiple computers and displays to run PSX can add to it an external visuals generator, like FSX, P3D and X-plane. Some of the applications that allow for this connection between PSX and another flight simulator used just for the visuals can inject PSX's weather data into FSX, P3D or X-plane so that the display in the sim better matches the weather being modelled in PSX.

Of course precipitation, icing effects, and many other details are included, and PSX is actually the only civil flight simulator presently available that simulates cold airmass effects on geopotential height. This means that on very cold days for a same QNH you can actually be considerably lower relative to the ground / sea level / any obstacles with the same altimeter reading, compared to a similar situation on an ISA or hot Summer day, due to the "atmosphere shrink" :-)


3) VISUALS: It's not for voyeurists....

No you can't see your own aircraft from the outside, or from inside other than the representation of the front / nose "bay door" when opening / opened / closing on the cargo variants of the 744.

You only have a front 2d view - no sideways views

World is represented very sparsely, with basic runway and taxiway representation, but with slope data being available and represented so that you can have runways or taxiways with a slant or bumps, and of course when taxiing along a rising taxiway power may be required on a more loaded aircraft.

Used with X-plane for the visuals PSX can even import X-plane's terrain mesh, creating a perfect combination between the two simulators and overriding PSX's mesh data in that case.


4) MULTIPLE INSTANCES

One can use PSX on a single PC, even a laptop, or in multiple PCs and displays, on a client-server based environment, allowing for exquisite variations and reproduction, for instance, of a 744 cockpit mockup.

Interface with sophisticated hardware is another possibility, which together with the above can provide the perfect framework for a home cockpit setup.

There aren't many videos about PSX in youtube, but if you search for "aerowinx psx" you'll find a few worth watching.

As a last note I would like to point out that many times I start my PSX flight sessions at my home desktop PC, then continue in my laptop, specially if it's a long range / intercontinental flight, and end again at the desktop :-)

You save a situation and start from the exact point you saved it without any glitches at all.

Although I have been testing various external visual generation options, for FSX, P3D and X-Plane, I always end making much more use of PSX standalone. The out-of-windshield visuals can be regarded as limited, but they provide practically all necessary visual aids for operating the sim, just as a B747-400 is operated IRL most of the time, I guess...

[Hardy Heinlin]

Hi Floris,

regarding the other questions ...

for instance does the wind effect the plane realistic?

Yes. The wind effects on the aircraft have been fine-tuned a lot in the past years, and the real-life 744 pilots and training captains on here seem to be quite happy with it now! :-)

about the emergences this sim can simulated> hows does this work, is there a list of all the errors in the simulation so i can click for instance on engine fire?

Malfunctions can be introduced by pulling the respective circuit breakers or by using the malfunction pages on the Instructor screen where malfunctions can be programmd by certain trigger criteria (airspeed, altitude, time, etc. pp.).

Malfunctions will also occur if you do something wrong.

can i land this aircraft for instance in sea for an emergency ...?

Yes.

can the landing gear brake when the landing is too rough ...?

Yes. There are many, various kinds of gear malfunctions in the model, symmetric and asymmetric constellations, and many operational faults (electrical, hydraulic, control logic etc.).

if i dont put deicing on, (on the ground)  will this effect the run way lenght the plane need to take off or even that the airplane wont take off (there where plane accidents with deicing failures in the past during take off)

Brake efficiency depends on the weather (rain, ice) and on the tire states etc. Icing also affects pitot tubes and aerodynamics etc. pp.

how is the viewing abbility is it possible to use a button so you can navigate to all the screens?  and is 1 screen possible?

Yes, and there are multiple view control options: mouse or keyboard or joystick buttons. Or network inputs ...


Regards,

|-|ardy

[farrokh747]

Hi Floris -

If you go to the tutorial section of the forum, you can see some more details there...

cheers,

fc

[florismulock]

Thanks a lot, wow great simulation then finally something what is close to the real plane

[GodAtum]

I've got a few questions.

1/ Does PSX simulate tire failure on landing?
2/ Watching a Tv documentary, they said that cold weather freezes the hydraulics? Does PSX simulate that?

[florismulock]

just bought the game, within 7 days i get it!  looking forward!

[andrej]

just bought the game

Game? ? ? ?   

Seriously, congratulations!  You have done some very wise decision that you will not regret. I use the sim on a singe PC along with P3D scenery generator, flying online. It's a dream...

Well, one day I will build me a fixed based flight sim (my real dream).

Read the manual, learn the systems, and you will really appreciate how deeply is everything simulated.

Happy landings!

[Hardy Heinlin]

I've got a few questions.

1/ Does PSX simulate tire failure on landing?

Yes, and not only on landing.

2/ Watching a Tv documentary, they said that cold weather freezes the hydraulics? Does PSX simulate that?

No. What is this documentary about?

[emerydc8]

florismulock,
These are my observations about PSX. I think you will discover that you made a good decision to invest in PSX.

1. PSX allows you to network over more than one computer without having to deal with FSUIPC or Wide View. Of course, PMDG is not networkable at all.

2. PSX allows you to undock any part of the cockpit you want and display it on another screen, or put multiple sections of the cockpit on just one screen. You don't have to re-arrange/re-position the screens every time you start the program like PMDG. It is incredibly versatile. In PMDG, certain panels are simply not undockable. In FSX/PMDG, when you get into more elaborate setups where you have large screens for the visuals and a functioning throttle quadrant with separate instrument display screens, you have to use FSX Cockpit mode (not Virtual Cockpit mode) to get the visuals to appear correctly on the screens; but when you are in Cockpit mode for the visuals out the windshield, you cannot move switches with your mouse or with a touch screen. This really limits you. PSX has no VC mode, so you have the benefit of a Cockpit mode where you have visuals, and you can still move switches with a mouse or touch screen. Check out Britjet's setup -- a whole cockpit made almost entirely of touch screens. Pretty impressive.

3. In PSX, an engine failure on takeoff feels like a real engine failure on takeoff. When you are light at high power settings, it requires almost full rudder to keep it on the runway -- just like the real airplane. The asymmetry does not end as soon as you rotate, as it does in FSX/PMDG. This is likely an FSX issue, but since PMDG and other programs piggyback on FSX, they too are limited. As a result, once airborne, there is zero asymmetric effect with an engine out. With FSX/PMDG, you might as well be flying a single-engine airplane. The developers selling software that piggybacks onto FSX, and even those selling hardware that push the software, either do not know about this material limitation or choose not to disclose it. I think it's the latter.

4. PSX handling characteristics are much closer to the real airplane -- in most cases indistinguishable. It is much harder to fly than FSX/PMDG. I'm sure there are other reasons, but from my perspective as a real-world 744 pilot, I think this is mainly because PSX correctly models the lag time between control input and actual aircraft response, and also takes into account that once you do make the correction, there is a certain amount of momentum in that direction that must be dealt with too. PSX just feels like the real plane. It's hard to explain unless you've flown the real plane. There is a huge difference as you will see.

5. PSX has the ability to save a situation and go back to it in a matter of a second without having to reposition switches or reprogram the CDU like I always had to do in FSX/PMDG when I saved a situation and re-opened it in the air.

6. Last, but not least, Hardy's attention to detail and his relentless efforts to make PSX as close to the real airplane as possible makes PSX the choice for me. As for revisions, rather than start out by submitting a "trouble ticket," the PSX forum is used to collaborate and have an open discussion about whether it should be changed at all and why. Evidence is presented and arguments are made. If Hardy decides it should be changed, we don't have to wait for a year before the next update to see the results. In most cases, the beta versions are published for everyone to test and provide further input. Most of the revisions at this stage seem to be things that even a type-rated 744 pilot probably wouldn't catch on a normal flight, but because PSX allows you to repeat situations so effortlessly, it gives users the chance to apply a higher level of scrutiny, especially when they are looking for any issues that do not exactly model the real aircraft.

Jon D.

[florismulock]

thanks emergy! great to hear its very close to the real are plane.   iam soo looking forward to fly this plane!

it works with all flight yokes and rudders right ?  ( i have a saitek pro flight yoke system with rudder and thrust levers)

[emerydc8]

I have Precision Flight Controls and it works great with PSX. The Saitek should work too, but maybe someone else can chime in and verify that.

[tango4]

Well, I do have a Saitek Cessna yoke with rudder pedals and use my warthog for the throttles. It works flawlessly (although I hope to move to PFC at christmas). The only issue I have is that PSX loses my assignments frequently: the reason I guess is that my controllers are all connected to a usb hub, that I frequently unplug as my main computer is now a laptop (a powerful gaming one) and I move it around.
Apart from that, all the others have said it way better than I could...but just buy it ! That sim is absolutely brilliant and quite unique. It is not perfect of course, but I do think it is not only the best 744 sim, I think that without many doubts it is the best airliner sim available to the general public. I am not an airline pilot, but even though it is expensive, I don't regret my money AT ALL !
And this very forum combined with Hardy's fantastic dedication to his product makes it even more unique.

Charles

[emerydc8]

I think that without many doubts it is the best airliner sim available to the general public.

I couldn't agree more. When I originally installed PSX, I saved all my PMDG programs because I wasn't sure it would work out. Needless to say, I have since deleted them all from my hard drive. No looking back!

[tango4]

Jon (emerydc8), quick question for you as mention it in one the posts above:
You are saying that there are zero asymetric effects when airborne in FSX.
I had the PMDG B744 quite a few years ago so I don't really remember (on FS2004 something like 10 years ago I guess !). But in "recent" PMDG lineup (meaning 737 and 777), I really have the feeling that those effects are modeled somehow. I only own the 777 at the moment (because I owned the 737 on FSX, but I only have P3D on my new computer) and for what I remember I had to trim it in an engine failure, and re trim it for each thrust change (for the 777 I would have to test it disconnecting the TAC).
Are you meaning that NO EFFECT at all are modelled or that some more SUBTLE one are not modelled ?
But please bear with me?I might be incorrect.

And regarding Majestic Q400, I'm pretty sure this is modeled because they use an external flight dynamics model.

PS: sorry once again for hijacking a thread....
Charles

[emerydc8]

Hi Charles,

It was my experience that once you rotated, there was virtually no need to use rudder for asymmetry caused by an engine out on the PMDG 744 with FSX. The 777 was the same, even with TAC disabled. I think I even tried it with the yaw dampers off, but still no difference. It would definitely yaw on the ground with an engine failure at V1, but once you rotated, there was virtually no need to use rudder to correct. I remember I asked PMDG about it and I think their position was that it was a limitation of FSX. Maybe P3D is different.

[cagarini]

It's a well known limitation, affecting their models since the first 737 released for fs9.

Other multi-engine jet models, like even the default b747-400 that comes with fsx, perform much better in this area - thrust asymmetry. I believe it results from some compromise due to the way they try to, within the necessary MSFS platform limitations, create an as accurate as possible reproduction of other features.

Just like prop torque and other effects are reduced to zero above Vs0 in MSFS, those asymmetry effects can be felt acceptably while you're still in contact with ground ( like up to Vr ), but "vanish" once speed increases and you're flying in a rather unplausible way.

In the 777 you can turn off TAC, and still feel no plausible effects inflight.

[tango4]

Well, I just ran a quick test on the B777, simulating a V1 cut with TAC dicsonnected (under P3D V3), and guess what...you are totally correct ! (not much of a surprise, I  know !)
I even disconnected PFC to be in direct control law, same thing basically.
Well, I did not pratice engine out in P3D for quite a while and did not even remember that (the only aircraft I really flew in P3D in the recent months is the Q400).

I guess that is the biggest problem with PSX... Thanks you Hardy for ruining our FSX experiences !
Sincerely, even though I miss a bit the nice graphics, each time I move to P3D again, I miss PSX and its attention to every detail.

Thanks Jon and Jose for both taking the time to answer me !

You can know go and read again this one (http://aerowinx.com/board/index.php?topic=3657.0) for the 100th time since this morning as we all just did ! It just made my day 

[florismulock]

thanks a lot again for the info!

is the normal procedure and abnormal procedure manual included in aerowinx?

and does the psx included navigations and airport charts (sids stars etc)? or is there a easy addon to show the charts in the simulation?

[GodAtum]

I've got a few questions.

1/ Does PSX simulate tire failure on landing?

Yes, and not only on landing.

2/ Watching a Tv documentary, they said that cold weather freezes the hydraulics? Does PSX simulate that?

No. What is this documentary about?

There was a BBC documentary called Cities in the Sky. they went to Russia where it was -40C.